My son is 8 weeks old. For awhile there, he was sleeping in 3-4 hour clips at night. He'd get up around 11:00 when we were ready to go to bed, again at 2ish, and then not again until DH was getting up to get ready for work, at 6ish. Then he'd sleep for an hour or so, and take a long nap later in the morning.

The past two nights, he's been getting up every two hours. And hardly napping during the day! He almost always takes a 3.5 hour nap sometime in the late morning, and then he's up all day after that just about, except for maybe half an hour here or there.

We try to put him to bed around 8:00...starting at 7:30 or so, we give him a bath, try to read him stories (which he usually screams through), and then put him down after he nurses. And he nurses for a LONG time. Getting him to go to sleep takes well over an hour each night. Nurse, change, nurse, crib, cry, nurse, crib, cry, repeat. He finally cashes out, but will only stay down for 2 hours lately.

How much sleep "should" he be getting at night at this age? Is it "normal" to wake up that often? And what about the daytime...should be be wide awake from early afternoon until he goes to bed? I'm thinking maybe he's overtired, but I've tried everything I can think of to get him to go to sleep.

He definitely has colic. He also has reflux, but that seems to be pretty much in check with medication. When he screams, it's not an "I'm in pain" scream. I've even tried gripe water, but that just seems to make him scream louder. :lol:

Any suggestions to get him to sleep longer? He's exclusively breast fed, and I know I'm producing enough based on what I pump and the fact that I still have milk after he's done nursing. He also sleeps swaddled, since he wakes himself right up if he's not.

His two month checkup is Monday and I plan to ask then for suggestions as well, but Monday's a long way off when you're not getting any sleep. :lol:

He could be having a growth spurt? I am sorry about the lack of sleep. I can commiserate ... and that with a 17 month old! LOL
I don't remember the sleep facts of that age.

My first thought was growth spurt:

http://www.kellymom.com/bf/normal/growth-spurt.html

(this is a good site to check out anyway). This says that growth spurts typically are 4-6 weeks, and 3 months, but every kid is different. Wasn't Nick two weeks early anyway? This could be his 6 wk growth spurt. The LCs are the hospital told me that preemies have their growth spurt at the age they're supposed to be.

ETA: Does your pediatrician have a "call in hour" where you can call for questions? I know there is a great resource in the people here but thought if your doctor has call in hour it would be another option for you in situations where you're days away from an appointment :)

I'm sorry that you're not getting much sleep.

My first thought was growth spurt, too. The first thing to remember is that just when you think you've gotten into a predictable routine, it will change. Oh, what fun. :bighug:

My first concern is that he's not emptying the breast. The breastmilk meal is like a full-course dinner: it begins with the soup (thin, watery milk-the foremilk) and ends with dessert (think, creamy milk-the hindmilk). The foremilk contains a lot of lactose, and the hindmilk contains an enzyme that helps them digest the lactose. If he's not emptying at least one breast, he may be having tummy trouble from the lactose in the foremilk. Make sure he empties at least one breast before switching to the next-you said he nurses a looong time, so you probably already are, but whatever you're nursing on the first side now, add 10 minutes or until he's frustrated (that's a good sign that he's not getting anything else).

My next question is, have you made any changes to your diet? I think by 8 weeks this would probably have already come up, but I'll ask anyway just in case: have you tried eliminating dairy from your diet? It upsets many babies (even though they drink YOUR milk... go figure). At first I gave up milk but then had cheese, and ice cream... duh! Not just milk, Dairy! And I made that mistake a couple of times before I realized the full extent of "dairy" :giggle:. Also, culprits can be tomatos, broccoli, peanuts/peanut butter, citrus, spicy foods, garlic, caffeine. If you're eating any of these things regularly they could be bothering his tummy, try eliminating. Sometimes eliminating all of the possible offenders and then adding back on at a time can help isolate his true aversion.

So, if you've already dealt with your diet, what's next? Have you tried white noise/sound machines in/near his crib? Do you have a matress wedge? You might already since he's got reflux, but if you don't it will tilt his matress slightly up at the head and help ease some of the reflux from laying horizontally.

Now, desperate times call for desperate measures: only you know if you're desperate, and some of us have definitely been desperate before so it does happen... will he sleep in the swing, bouncy seat or carseat? If so, go for it. Some people even put the carseat into the crib with sleeping baby in it. It's not a first step and it's not ideal as a last resort, and can cause habits that become hard to break, but sometimes you get to the point where do you don't care, you just need more than 20 minutes of sleep. So don't feel bad if you've got the kid napping in his swing for 3 hours or if he sleeps in his bouncy seat at night. Some may severely frown upon these things, but many of us have gone there and our children have survived. :)

I'll see what else I can think of!

I don't have two hands to type right now but most of what Kristen said is what I was going to suggest. Charlotte went through the same thing at around 7 weeks and now..well..we put her down at 11 and she sleeps till 8am :lol:!!!! She does power nurse before we put her down..meaning about a good hour of nursing. But I get her good and out before laying her down and she seems to do well. We did the whole car seat in the crib about three nights straight...I just needed some sleep!

I think we've tried all of this stuff. :lol: I hadn't thought of growth spurt, so thank you! Marcy, no he was on time (well, 2 days early). Yes, I can call the doctor whenever I want, but since we're so close to an appointment and his reflux is in check, etc., I figured I'd just wait.

Kristen, I'm pretty sure he's emptying the breast. I don't switch sides until he pulls away or starts whining. And during the day, he takes a bottle (we've been trying since he was three weeks old to get him to take a bottle, and he's just now getting good at it, so I bottle feed him breast milk all day so he's used to it for when I go back to work), so I know how much he is drinking. And he seems good and out when I put him down, but he'll only stay that way for two hours. Sometimes it seems that he just wants to suck when he wakes up after two hours, and not eat much. So I've given him a pacifier, which somewhat helps. I just started that, so he's not really great at keeping hold of it yet though, so maybe when he gets better it'll help.

I worked on my diet back when his reflux was first starting. Cutting out dairy didn't do anything for him. I cut out caffeine when I was pregnant with him and haven't started back up, I very rarely eat broccoli now, nothing spicy, etc. I can tell when he cries that he's not in pain...it's different than his reflux cry. He just sounds pissed off or whiny. :lol: The doctor said it's probably colic.

He has plenty of white noise. He has a heartbeat bear in his crib which has really, really helped. He also has the Fisher Price aquarium. We use one or the other usually...so he's not over stimulated. And I play music all day long because he is much calmer that way.

Oh, we've been there with the sleep in the swing thing. He hates his carseat, so that is out. He usually takes his longest naps in his swing. He's usually on his side, strapped in, and the swing is on the highest setting. He'll fall asleep and stay asleep that way. He'll occasionally nap in his bouncy seat as well. I've somewhat given up on his crib for naps, but he always sleeps in it at night. If we're really desperate, he'll sleep in his swing for a stretch at night, but not often. Because of his reflux, he sleeps on his side in his crib. We've tried elevating the mattress, but that didn't do anything.

So now you can see why I'm out of ideas. :lol: Maybe I'm expecting too much, but I just figured by 8 weeks, he'd be getting more sleep! He cries A LOT. When he first came home, he had his days and nights mixed up. We got that fixed, and a week later, reflux. That is finally in check, and now it's colic. I can't help but think if he got more sleep, he'd be happier. When he wakes up from his power naps, he's often in a good mood after I feed him. He's been to the doctor and there's nothing "wrong" with him...he just seems to fight sleep so bad and I'm not sure how to get him to stop doing that.

If he's nursing as much as you say, it is probably a growth spurt I've been there with Sarah, and I know how it feels.

At that age, I think I started rocking Sarah to sleep. I had a lot of the same problems with her that you are having with Nicky. The pediatrician advised against it because she didn't want Sarah to get into that habit, but she broke it on her own well before she was a year old. And my thought was the pediatrician wasn't going to come over and put Sarah to sleep herself, so whatever.

And my thought was the pediatrician wasn't going to come over and put Sarah to sleep herself, so whatever.

Amen to that. :dude:

Well damn, that was all of my ideas! Is he happy when held, and just cranky when you put him down? Or is he cranky even when you're holding him? Zack was #1, Mason was #2. Mason was colicky, but we now know the reason and it's not the same as what you've got going on. It could just be that you've got a PITA kid, and that's his personality. My boys were both just their own person and doing things there own way, which happened to not be sleeping. It totally sucks, and it makes me twitch to read about babies that sleep from 11pm-8am ( :giggle: Jayne, you know how much I adore you! :akiss: I'm 100% jealous, but still 100% happy for your sake! :nod: Alyssa was a great sleeper too... girl, what on earth is your secret???)

You might want to read "The Baby Whisperer" by Tracy Hogg (is that the correct Tracy? I get her confused with the TCOYF author). It gives great advice about how to be on top of your baby's natural habits and ways to avoid common pitfalls that lead to long-term sleep drama. I didn't read it until Zack was 8-9 months, and it was too late. The time to read it is now so don't wait!

Amy, I've tried that too. I could rock him for well over an hour and he's still wide awake.

Kristen, no he's always fussy. The only time of day he's truly happy is when he's getting a bath. He gets one every day even though he doesn't need it, just so I have 15 minutes or so of quiet. :lol: I have to be constantly rocking/bouncing/dancing him to keep him quiet. He isn't amused by his swing/bouncy seat/activity mat, etc. for more than 10 minutes. He's not the type of baby I could just hold quietly or have him sit in my lap. I can't even have a telephone conversation unless he's asleep. It's like he's never ever happy, unless he's getting a bath. I've tried tons of stuff to try to make him happy, and nothing really works, for more than a very short while, which is why I started thinking he's overtired. I may be totally wrong about that, though.

Thanks for the book suggestion...I will try it!

There might just not be an explanation... I think that's why/when they call it "collick" ... because there's nothing else to call it. We called Mason "Les Miserables" (I do know that is plural and Mason is singular :giggle: ) for the first 2 months of his life, he was just a miserable baby. It sucked. And I had Zack, who got no attention whatsoever because I was trying to comfort screaming Mason All. Day. Long. I know this doesn't help, but you're definitely not alone. :hug99: The good news is, it passes. Usually by 3 months but maybe sooner. I know the idea of 4 more weeks makes you want to go to your closet and start packing, but in the grand scheme it will have passed quickly, if you can just survive the next few weeks. That doesn't mean he'll become a great sleeper, but it will still be better if he's not screaming all day, and you can at least make yourself a sandwich and eat it in peace. :hug99:

It's like he's never ever happy, unless he's getting a bath.
I remember when Anna was little, I thought that there should be some kind of hot tub for babies where the water stays warm for them.

Sorry he's so fussy. Like Kristen said, if you've tried all that, and he's still fussy - he might just be fussy. :hug99:

Do you have a sling or other carrier so that you can wear him around? Maybe the "being with mommy" might help?

Hey, Jess, I know I'm probably not a ton of help since I can't drive, but if you want you can bring him over here. I can hold him and deal with him for a bit so you can have a break. You can nap, have something to eat, whatever. We can watch Buffy or Angel with the closed captioning on so we don't have to worry about hearing the actors over the screaming. :lol: Nobody is sick at my house anymore, so it should be safe to bring him.

And Marcy has a good idea with the sling. Sarah loved it if I put her in the Snugli. It was harder to get around with her like that, but at least she'd shut up.

And I was looking through my journal, and Sarah slept with us a lot at that age. Just make sure you take the right precautions - no fluffy pillows or heavy comforters, etc. - and he'll be fine. We never rolled on Sarah because we found we were very very aware of her and sensitive to her movements. It's worth a shot anyway if you ask me.

Colic sucks. And the only way to get out of it is to go through it. Maggie screamed every night for hours. We'd hold her, we'd rock her, we'd do anything we possibly could. When something calmed her down, we'd try it again and be so confused when it didn't work the next time. And during the day, when she wasn't actually colicky, she was no picnic, either.

I feel for you. Those were some very dark days. Very dark. But they did end. She didn't sleep much better, but the screaming lessened. And when she was around 3.5, she did actually start to sleep through the night.

One thing that helped was the 5 Ss from the Happiest Baby on the Block-- Side, Suck, Shhh, Swing and Swaddle. (here's an article (http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/514376)) Oh, how I love the swaddle. We used a digital recording of Maggie's fetal heartbeat for a calming noise, and there were many nights when it seemed like the louder we put it (within reason) the better it worked.

:hug99:

I feel your pain with the colic too -- Connor was colicky and I honestly never thought it would. But around 5 months it finally did. He'd start screaming around 3 p.m. and pass out from exhaustion around midnight. I remember meeting my husband in the garage when he got home from work around 6 p.m., handing Connor over and going for a 20 minute walk so I could get away from it all. Our biggest help in dealing with the situation was swaddling (he was swaddled til he was five months old) and the swing. Sometimes he'd be screaming in the swing, but it would often lull him into a stupor. At nighttime, he'd wake up every 90 minutes or so to eat. So much fun. Especially when his twin was sleeping 5 hours straight from about two weeks old on.

The one thing that got me through was, on the advice of a friend of mine, telling myself that he'd only be this needy for a very short part of his life. It didn't end things sooner, but it did keep me a little calmer while enduring it.

Good luck!

Have you tried running the vacuum cleaner? That worked for Jack for a while. Good luck!

Jessica, we have so been there ourselves. Like Sheila said, those are very dark days. I know this is your first, and you don't know how it is going to get better, but it WILL get better. I promise. It sounds to me like you are doing a great job. :hug99:

Now, things to try and make it a bit better for now. Connie had a good suggestion w/ the vacuum cleaner. We discovered that by accident with Rayna. DH ran it to clean the house a bit, and she got quiet. As soon as he turned it off, she went right back to screaming. It was literally like flipping a switch. When we turned it on she didn't just slowly stop screaming, she physically jerked, sighed, and calmed down. And the vacuum was loud. Really loud. We had to use it for more than three months, burned the motor up but it was totally worth it. It was the only thing that got us through.

Now, things to try and make it a bit better for now. Connie had a good suggestion w/ the vacuum cleaner. We discovered that by accident with Rayna. DH ran it to clean the house a bit, and she got quiet. As soon as he turned it off, she went right back to screaming. It was literally like flipping a switch. When we turned it on she didn't just slowly stop screaming, she physically jerked, sighed, and calmed down. And the vacuum was loud. Really loud. We had to use it for more than three months, burned the motor up but it was totally worth it. It was the only thing that got us through.

This is exactly how we discovered it. Jack was crying & screaming and Dh was running the vac in our bedroom. I stepped in there with Jack and he got quiet. I stepped back out & screaming. We burnt the motor out of our vacuum too. :giggle:

Thanks for all the suggestions and commiseration, everyone!

I ended up calling the doctor yesterday...to run everything by them to make sure they didn't think it was his reflux or that nothing was "wrong" with him, and to see if they had any suggestions. I had already tried just about everything the nurse suggested, which led her to reply, "oh wow, he has it bad!" :lol: She did suggest massage, so before bed, I raided our bathroom closet (SIL works for J&J and loaded him up with baby products) and got out bedtime lotion and gave him a massage. He LOVED it. Of course, as soon as I was done, he was crying again, but it was peace and quiet while it lasted. And now my hands are super soft. :lol:

The screaming doesn't get to me too badly. I mainly just feel bad because I can't make him feel better. DH can get pretty frustrated by it though, so I feel bad for him too.

Sheila, yes we try the 5 S's and they do help. He wouldn't sleep at all if it weren't for swaddling. He fights that SO badly...but he'll wake up after 20 minutes or so otherwise. We use the SwaddleMe blankets, because he can bust out of a swaddle with a regular blanket. The other S's work pretty well for him too...we can calm him down eventually with them, but it's still an hour long process at best to get him to go to sleep at night.

I have a sling, but he's decided he hates it lately. :lol: He does like the Snugli when DH uses it with him, so I'll have to give that a try during the day. And I haven't tried the vacuum...we can vacuum all around him if he's asleep and he won't wake up, so maybe he'll like it when he's awake, too. Thanks!

We can't let him sleep with us. DH is a fitful sleeper...I've gotten kicked/hit in my sleep before, so I don't trust him with the baby in our bed. :lol:

Amy, thanks for the offer. DH is off for a few days after today, so I'll have some help around here, but maybe next week some time.

Wouldn't you know, today Nicky has been great. :lol: At his 4am feeding, he smiled at DH when he changed him, and he also stopped nursing for a few minutes so he could smile at me. That's a big deal to us because he never smiles...he's usually too busy crying. He took his bottle without crying, played on his playmat, and is chilling in his bouncy seat (I put the toy bar on it for the first time today). He hasn't cried at all today since he woke up...just whined if he wants something. It's like a totally different baby! I'm not sure how long he'll keep that up, but even for a little while, it's nice. I've felt like we don't even know this little guy yet, because he's been so screamy for so long, that we don't really even know his personality at all yet. And today I'm getting a glimpse of him and he's really fun underneath all that yelling. :)

Remind me next time I see you to loan you the book Healthy Sleep Habits, Happy Child. It's generally for older kids, but it does discuss how to read your baby's signals. It's a very, very small window between tired and overtired. It's possible that you're missing a signal and getting him down when he's overtired. Sarah's 3 and she's still a pistol with fighting sleep if she's overtired. I remember doing that as well, and Sarah was a ton easier when I got better at reading her signals.

I feel for you. Jacob had colic. I thought I was going to die, but one night around 3 months he just quit crying all the time. It was amazing! I woke up in the middle of the night and realized had hadn't cried for 4 hours! One thing he liked was the sound of running water. I used to put him in his bouncy seat in the bathroom doorway, then turn on the tub. Killed our waterbill, but he was quiet for awhile. Another one was the dryer. He could sit in the laundry room for 30-40 minutes happy as a clam listening to the dryer. :dunno:

One of my thoughts is that maybe he's sleeping too long for his morning nap? 3.5 hours seems a little long for a morning nap. Maybe you could try waking him after 1- 1 1/2 hours, keeping him up for awhile, and retrain him to take an afternoon nap. It might make him a little less overtired and cranky in the evenings.

Good luck!

I was going to suggest the same thing Shel did with the morning nap, maybe shortening that one will lengthen the other ones.

I have been lucky with the fact I have only had 1 out of 4 kids be like this! If it was my first I am not too sure how many more I would have had, it was a form of torture, Riley screamed for the first 14 months of his life, he had chronic silent reflux and colic. I shudder remembering those days. He would only sleep in my arms, and I became so desperate for some sort of sleep that we used to fix up blankets sorrounding me so I could sleep holding him and not worry about dropping him.

My other thought for your nighttime routine is maybe start it a bit earlier, maybe it's being left a bit late considering he isn't napping in the afternoon and he is getting to the point of being overtired. Start the bath/reading book etc maybe an hour earlier and see if that helps. Watch out for the tired signs.

Good luck, I wouldn't wish this on my worst enemy, sleep deprivation is the worst!

I also want to add that I had Lucas sleeping through the night at the 8 week mark, and here he is at 5 months waking again at 2am for a feed. Like it was said earlier, no sooner do you have them in a routine and they go and change it on you :crazy: